Mission Tues 13th July, Pilots Needed.

[Flyco]

Phlash, yes there are still slots. Consider yourself aboard.

[Richard Rodgers]

Alan, the brief looks fine to me. Can't see anything that will cause issues

[Phlash]

Thanks Alan. If there is still room in Pontiac 2 that would be great.

Back from 2 weeks in sunny Argyll and Bute!

[309 Geoff]

Alan,
I had to cross reference the 97 miz file with our waypoints, to fully understand the brief. It's clear now, but an image showing the routes would have helped.

Just a couple of points:-
1. Pontiac 2 description, para 11, mentions Pontiac 1. I guess it should read Pontiac 2.
2. AWACS frequency is shown as 250.1. Is that correct? AI AWACS is usually 251, and Live AWACS 251.5.

Otherwise, a clear, and timely brief that details the strategy around both flights. Thanks.

[Flyco]

Thanks, Geoff. You are right on both counts: the AWACs Freq is 251.0; and para 11 should refer solely to Pontiac-2.

I agree with you about a map. Unfortunately I have not been able to procure a decent map, that is reproducible and on which I can enter salient routes and points. The one in the second post "Squadron Missions\RAF Air Mission Tues 13 Jul 21", has a good overview, but it is too small a scale, and very congested. Alternatively, you can download my mission and capture that map, again not perfect. In the Caucasus there is a simple outline map "General Map 1:3 000 000" which I used to plan on. I am always reluctant to get maps from outside DCS, because they tend to deviate from real life in some areas.

[309 Geoff]

Below are two images taken from CombatFlite, showing Pontiac 1 & Pontiac 2 routes. I haven't modified them with powerpoint.

PONTIAC 1

Pontiac 1.JPG (330.82 KiB) Viewed 1527 times

PONTIAC 2

Pontiac 2.JPG (346.24 KiB) Viewed 1527 times

In future missions, I would be happy to give a helping hand.

[Flyco]

I do have a copy of Combat Flight, and have used it occasionally in the past. However, to be frank, for briefing individual units on a small portion of a major operation, I find it of limited help. Much of the detail on the map is obscured by gaudily coloured symbols or unnecessary lists. For example the Mission block in the RH Top corner contains very little information. The routes are OK, but again too big - there is little ability to mark waypoints clearly, or indicate areas of likely threats etc.

I prefer a simple topo, with my routes, times, and waypoints marked. To my mind the A-10C TAD provided pretty much all of that - and updates it in flight.

For a pre-mission brief, I can see a case for something like Combat Flight, but given that flights generally have only 10-15 minutes to brief, and there are always last minute changes which you cannot transcribe to such a limited display.

At FTS we always would insist on students drawing up a map, on a standard quarter- or half-million map, including headings, time, times, available diversions, IP, Target and Exit routes, fuel checks etc. They would study this in detail and then brief the QFI before flying it. I confess, that I still have a hand-drawn crib sheet for many missions I fly in DCS on which I mark relevant points that the TAD does not automatically provide - and I fly with it tucked into a little pocket on the side of my seat. The kneepad includes some of this but DCS cuts out sections at random (e.g. long legs between waypoints) and uses whatever scale it thinks appropriate (with which I often do not agree).

As an example, I attach my in-flt notes for a RW LL mission I sometimes fly. You will see that it is basically a list of headings, timings and a few specific reminders that I have noted down as a result of pre-flt route study. With the A-10s TAD, the routes and timings are already available, but points where there is room for confusion I do keep a written note of (and these days I am easily confused!)

I am currently drawing up my Pre-flt brief for tonight's mission!

[Flyco]

Just in case time gets tight this evening, an outline of the Pontiac-1 Flt brief is attached.

[filthymanc]

Sorry gents. Had to let you down tonight.

[Flyco]

Not a bad effort. Despite the initial chaos, we got airborne OK, and transited to our respective locations. Both the North and the South group got 7 cargo vessels, each, and the North group also got all the ground targets. We all got back safely (with only a couple of scratches). I suspect we all had weapons left at the end.

Not quite 100%, we left 3 speedboats at the North location and 4 ground soldiers at the South location. Additionally, I took too long finding and splashing the last 2 cargo vessels.

I thought the start was a shambles - again no clear briefing on who was to do what when, and lots of time lost in covering detail that should have ben available at least 24 hrs earlier. I do not know why clear written brief outlines cannot be produced early. Also I am not sure that the F-18 OCU will be happy continuing to support us if we don't sharpen our act.